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How can Americans best remember those killed on that horrible day in 1967?

Some details:

A retired college professor who has sailed approximately 8,000 miles to the eastern Mediterranean is expected to arrive at his destination within the next 24 hours: the exact location where Israeli forces tried to sink a US Navy ship in 1967, killing or injuring over 200 American servicemen.

Didn't you know?
Read on then,....

Or if you are one of those who deny's history, then call me all the usual names and be done with it already.

Larry Toenjes, 74 years old, is planning to hold a memorial service for those killed on board the ship, the USS Liberty. Israel shelled and torpedoed the ship, an electronics surveillance ship, in an attack that lasted as long as the attack on Pearl Harbor.

While Israel and its partisans have tried to claim that the attack was “a mistake,” a 2003 inquiry by an INDEPENDENT COMMISSION led by a retired FOUR STAR NAVY ADMIRAL, a Rear Admiral, and the highest ranking Medal of Honor recipient in the U.S., a Marine General, announced on Capitol Hill that ALL THE EVIDENCE indicated that the attack had been INTENTIONAL, had consisted of an ACT OF WAR against the United States by ISRAEL, and that a COVER UP had been ORDERED by the White House.

In addition, the commission found that rescue flights had been recalled by President Lyndon Johnson and Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara. While almost no media covered the Capitol Hill briefing, a full record of its findings are in the Congressional Record and Stars and Stripes military newspaper.

Mr Toenjes, A TRUE PATRIOT.... who departed from Galveston, Texas, almost four months ago, is accompanied by a Marine veteran who joined him in Malta.

Toenjes will remain 12 miles offshore, in international waters, where the attack took place.

In a column published by the Galveston News, Toenjes explained that he was undertaking the voyage for two primary purposes: to honor the men who died in service to their country and to try to draw attention to attempts by their surviving families and crew mates to obtain the full government investigation that is legally required but that has been blocked by the powerful Israel Lobby.

Toenjes’ trip is being tracked on the website of the Council for the National Interest (CNI). When he arrives at his destination, the CNI website will stream live his memorial service, which will be carried by satellite phone to a radio program hosted by a Liberty survivor, Phil Tourney.

OF COURSE,...the national media have IGNORED this voyage (I wonder why eh?), Toenjes and Liberty survivors hope that the American public will learn about his undertaking by word of mouth, blogs, and social media like Yahoo Answers etc.

http://www.councilforthenationalinterest.org/costs/attackontheussliberty.html

http://ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/ul-commfindings.html

http://www.councilforthenationalinterest.org/costs/attackontheussliberty/item/652-boston-declaration.html

Is what this PATRIOT is doing "good"?

Shouldn't ALL AMERICANS be supporting him in his efforts to remember Americans who were killed in INTERNATIONAL WATERS,...By Israel?

All thoughts welcome.
bev.

I know more about IFF systems than you will ever know dear.

Oh yes I do.

I have used such systems many times IN BATTLE and in exercises.
Probably before you were born.

Go and try to wake up,..please.

Asked By: Clatty Mary - 9/8/2011
Best Answer - Chosen by Asker
The "Liberty Incident" was the product of gross incompetence by BOTH SIDES. Here is as detailed an account as YA allows space for regarding what really happened and why:

In June 1967 the NSA without notifying Israel or even U.S. 6th Fleet redirected the signals intelligence ship USS Liberty to operate just 12 instead of 100 miles off the coast of Sinai, in a war zone, in a lane not used by commercial shipping & declared off-limits by Egypt (i.e. only Egyptian warships were likely to be found there). At 6:00am on 6/8/67 an IDF patrol aircraft spotted the Liberty and reported her hull number GTR-5 to IDF Naval HQ where an hour later she was identified as American and marked as a neutral ship on the manual plotting (map) table with a wooden model. The problem with these old (pre-computer) manual plots is that they quickly become clogged with outdated and erroneous information and need to be cleared frequently. At 11:00am the watch changed at IDF Naval HQ and the new shift followed procedure by CLEARING THE BOARD, but did so without bothering to check if the neutral ship was still present. They simply assumed it had moved on! While just one of the many mistakes made that morning by both sides this typically appalling lack of basic professionalism is what ultimately sealed Liberty's fate. So yes, while the accusation that the IDF knew what and where the USS Liberty was is true, it is also meaningless as after 11:00am everyone in Israel who knew gone home to bed. For all practical purposes the Liberty had ceased to exist.

1/2 hour later panicky inexperienced IDF reservists at El Arish reported an explosion which they blamed erroneously on naval gunfire. The plotting board at IDF naval HQ was clear, showing no neutral or friendly ships so it was naturally assumed ANY ship in the area was hostile and the likely cause of this reported shelling. This set in motion a series of badly coordinated, virtually unplanned and haphazard attacks using resources wholly unsuited to the task. First a flotilla of 3 small Motor Torpedo Boats were dispatched (with considerable difficulty and delay) to intercept the phantom Egyptian warship, approaching the Liberty just as she was at the end of her "racetrack" patrol pattern and turning about back towards Egypt. The MTB commander interpreted this course change as an Egyptian warship turning to run for home so he pursued. Unable to catch the "fleeing enemy vessel" air support was called in and 2 flights of fighters on ground-attack missions were diverted to this effort. None of the pilots had any training in ship recognition or attack and were not armed for the job, having only guns and Napalm, not the AP rockets and delayed-action bombs one would use when planning to attack a ship. The jets arrived to look for the fleeing Egyptian warship, made a couple of passes at 3,000 feet altitude, saw no Israeli markings on the ship and therefore identified it as Egyptian - a Hunt or Z class destroyer. The ID was wrong but this was not their fault. They were not looking to see what ship this was but rather what Egyptian ship this was and for what little they knew about ships they had one. Remember, there was no other traffic on the plot so they were not expecting to find anything else but an Egyptian warship. At 1:58pm the aircraft were cleared to attack, which lasted 14 minutes until one of the pilots recognized Latin, not Arabic markings on the now burning ship, radioed the information to IDF Air Force HQ and broke off. This information was then passed to IDF Naval HQ but this was 1967, there was a war going on and the WW2 surplus IDF communications system was clogged with a massive backlog of messages. It would take another 2 hours before the Navy knew what the Air Force already knew - that USS Liberty was not an enemy ship.

25 minutes after the end of the air attack the MTB's finally caught-up the burning Liberty from astern and flashed a recognition signal. USS Liberty gave a vague reply and an (unauthorized) burst of machine gun fire. The MTB commander naturally interpreted this as an Egyptian ship fighting back so he attacked at 2:45pm with his elderly array of light guns & WW2 surplus torpedoes. 15 minutes later while circling the Liberty one of the boats made out the hull number GTR-5 in Latin, immediately ordered a cease-fire and offered assistance. Hardly the actions of someone intent on sinking a ship he knew all along was American. Subsequently the Israeli government paid compensation to the families of the 34 men killed in the attack and to the wounded as well as settlement for the for damage to the ship.

It is a curious thing the 1987 attack by our then-ally Iraq on the USS Stark, which killed more American's than the attack on USS Liberty is virtually forgotten today. In 4 years I have never seen anyone ask "Why did Iraq attack the Stark" on YA. But the Liberty comes up here at least weekly. Why is that?
Answered By: Mark F - 9/8/2011
Additional Answers ()
At least you're not even trying to be subtle...


.....so that's refreshing.....I guess...
Answered By: u_bin_called - 9/8/2011
The Liberty was an AGI, spy ship rigged to resemble a fishing trawler, a very common practice. The IFF, identification friend or foe protocol was used to id the ship. Once an IFF challenge is sent it must be met with the current response for the time. This required in those days the use of a very large cryptographic book. It was not met in time and the attack began. Once the mistake was realized, the attack halted. Nice try s*****g, you should know more of which you speak as do I.
Answered By: Bev - 9/8/2011
After ten official US investigations (including five congressional investigations), there was never any evidence that the attack was made with knowledge that the target was a US ship.
There is substantial evidence the attack was a tragic mistake caused by blunders of both the US and Israel. Eight US presidents, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush (41), Clinton, and Bush (43), have each accepted the conclusion that the attack was a tragic case of mistaken identity.
Nevertheless, conspiracy theorists continue to claim the Israelis knowingly attacked a US ship. By some estimates, there are more conspiracy theories about the Liberty incident than about the assassination of John F. Kennedy
The US NSA secret spy tapes declassified a few years ago confirm what EVERY US govt investigation concluded: Israel HAD NO IDEA IT WAS A US SHIP. It was accidental friendly fire.

"Only those with an ulterior motive can still cling to the conspiracy theories after Judge Jay Cristol's excellent coverage documents each detail that led to the tragic mistaken attack."
- ADM. LEON A. (BUD) EDNEY, USN (Ret.);
former NATO supreme allied commander, Atlantic; and commander-in-chief, U.S. Atlantic command

"After years of research for this book, Judge A. Jay Cristol has reached a similar conclusion to one my father reached in his June 18, 1967, endorsement of the findings of the court of inquiry. I commend Judge Cristol for his thoroughness and fairness, and I commend this work."
- SEN. JOHN McCAIN

"The Liberty Incident puts twenty-five years of conspiracy theories and political confusion to rest and marks the culmination of your exhaustive research. With your in-depth analysis of what really occurred on June 8th, 1967, you have shown the light of knowledge into the darkest corners of mistrust and misconceptions. [...] You truly deserve to be commended for your extensive research, analysis and conclusions resulting in the writing of The Liberty Incident. [Full text]"
- SEN. BOB GRAHAM
Chair, Senate Select Committee on Intelligence

"This is a story of mistakes in war as old as history and as current as today's headlines. Jay Cristol is well qualified to write this exhaustive history after analyzing, collecting, and cross-checking decades of interviews and reams of written material."
- ADM. DAVID E. JEREMIAH, USN (Ret.),
former vice chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff

"A. Jay Cristol, with his background as a chief federal judge, lawyer, naval officer, and carrier pilot, has brought unprecedented credentials to his investigation--and account of--The Liberty Incident."
- NORMAN POLMAR,
naval analyst and author of
The Naval Institute Guide to the Ships and Aircraft of the U.S. Fleet

"Judge Jay Cristol has completed exhaustive research, an accurate reconstruction of events, and persuasively reasoned analysis of the tragic circumstances which led to the Israeli attack on the Liberty.... A great book, I couldn't put it down!"
- ADM. JERRY JOHNSON, USN (Ret.),
former vice chief of naval operations

"The name I want you to remember is Jay Cristol.... He knows more about the Liberty than anybody else in the world.... He's got the most balanced view of anybody I've ever known."
- The late DONALD ENGEN,
former director, Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum

"This is the definitive book...a meticulous work...this book ends the debate."
- ELIOT A. COHEN,
Foreign Affairs, Nov/Dec 2002

"...an exquisitely researched and articulately presented analysis...a must-read for all who have an interest in the Liberty incident."
- Rear ADM. T. A. BROOKS, USN (Ret.)
Former Director of Naval Intelligence
Naval Intelligence Professionals Quarterly, Oct 2002
Answered By: affinity292 - 9/8/2011
By banning the Israel lobby from having any influence is the U.S. would be a start.

banning dual citizenship for Israelis also seems reasonable too.
Answered By: Arctic Dancer - 9/8/2011
Yes I remember watching a video of this, the ss liberty had a large stars & stripes flag flying, but were still bombed,shot at and torpedoed, and Johnson turned back the wings as they were going to the rescue.

The crew that was left, were told not to say anything about it.

So was 9/11 an inside job?
Answered By: Apollo - 9/8/2011
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The plan is that nurses and nurses practitioners will take data from patients (temperate, blood pressure, reports of pains, etc.), enter that into Watson, and Watson will order tests and make prescriptions and treatment plans. Unlike human doctors, Watson will KNOW EVERYTHING about medical science. Doctor errors currently kill about 100,000 patients per year in hospitals alone. Patients will DEMAND to be diagnosed by Watson (or other equivalent) & have a prescription by Watson, since studies will show that patients fare so MUCH better when Watson is their “doctor,” and the cost will be MUCH less. (7) Computers are now replacing the lawyers that formerly had to spend massive hours read through massive amounts of documents turned over to the opposing side in "discovery" in civil lawsuits. Documents now are turned over in digital form, and computers search in seconds them looking for key words and phrases. (8) Soon publishers will stop printing books on paper. Everyone will have an e-Reader device. That will be the END of every physical library and bookstore. (9) Soon computers will be able to general characters in movies that are indistinguishable from real humans. Not only actors will lose their jobs, but costume people, makeup people, scene construction people, camera operators, key grips, electricians, lighting experts, etc. (10) New machines are replacing the humans who pick vegetables in fields. (11) New machines are replacing human security guards. (12) Human airplane pilots, both in the military and in commercial service, will soon be extinct. The FAA has already approved testing of drone planes for commercial transportation of non-human cargo. (13) Most trades on Wall Street are already being made by computers. (14) The U.S. Postal Service is doomed. Paying thousands of people to drive around in little trucks to deliver little printed pieces of paper to each household each day is going to seem more and more like idiocy. (15) Most of the reviews and analysis currently being done by human accountants, actuaries, tax experts, and other financial analysts and consultants will be done must better, more more quickly, and much more accurately, by computers. (16) Web sites already are using computer programs to write the text for stories that report on sports games. The program integrates the statistics from the game into a story text that seems to have been written by a human being. (17)Most education at the college and high school level will soon be done online, eliminating a massive number of workers. Thus, GIGANTIC UNEMPLOYMENT, in the range of 70-80?is coming soon to the USA. This will result in Rio De Janeiro type slums all over the USA. That will result in calls for gov't wealth redistribution, which will result in Armed Revolution, Counter-Revolution, concentration camps, & Latin American-style death squads. The rich and ultra-rich are never going to let any government get control of their wealth. Huge bloody CONFLICT is coming. * * * Politicians keep repeating the old canard that the solution is to train and retrain Americans for the "jobs of the future." But they are either morons or are lying, since anyone who thinks about it can easily see that even if every American worker had an engineering degree or a computer science degree, the economy just doesn't need that many engineers and computer scientists. * * * * * * * Why don't more people see this? Why aren't more people talking about this? We are facing soon a catastrophe in the USA (and in other places) on par of the plagues in Europe that killed half of the population in certain areas, and on par with the depopulation in Europe brought about by WWI and WWII. Sure, you can just repeat the Luddite Fallacy, and proclaim that the economy will always create enough jobs for most people to survive. But there is no law of economics that says that any law of economics will always operate the same. Laws of economics are not like the laws of physics. Economies and life forms can and do evolve in fundamental ways that make former economic models and ways of life obsolete. I'm sure the last tribe of Neanderthals were certain that nothing was ever going to change, right before the Homo Sapiens swooped down on them, chased them into a dead end canyon were other Homo Sapiens were lying in wait with big clubs. * * * * * * * * * In the past the Luddite Fallacy was valid since machines always needed the mental acuity that only human operators could provide, and machines frequently needed maintenance by skilled human hands and minds. But now machines have mental functions that equal or surpass what humans can provide in most work functions. And computers aren't so much repaired anymore as just thrown away and replaced. How many cell phone repair shops have you ever seen? Even most laptop computers are replaced rather than repaired. More and more laptop computers never even need to be repaired for years and years. In short, when the economy has no use for most Americans, all h*ll is going to brake loose, & that's coming soon. * * * * *
2 answers - Asked By: Perro Americano Invicto - 5/16/2013
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